Ruminations in Korea

Comment by Christopher

19 March 2004 @ 12:40 am

Wow, that is some disgusting stuff. And I posted the cartoon! Those blackface sisters….THAT makes me sick. Whew…what a world we live in…

Comment by Dan Mehlhorn

19 March 2004 @ 1:40 am

I remember the shooting well. One fact may change the opinion you formed from the one paragraph posted. The black girl was taller and in better shape than the woman behind the counter, and the black girl almost slapped the Korean lady senseless. No, she didn’t deserve to be shot, but the girl had no right assaulting the storekeeper.

The LA press played up the angle from the black racist point of view, but what about the repeatedly assaulted and robbed Korean storeowners and workers?

Comment by Jae

19 March 2004 @ 2:55 am

I dunno… It’s sad, but racism is everywhere. You know, most of people in the US, when making comments about my eyes, they say they are “slanted”. My eyes are slanted and my nose is so not pointy, now what?

It’s just sad that racial stereotypes are everywhere. Well, for one good example of that is the Chief Illiniwek (check out this site - http://www.retirethechief.org/index.html) of University of Illinois. Well, the saddest thing behind this Chief is that, the alumni won’t fund money if school gets rid of this. Well, anyway, enough of this.

Well, it might be even worse in Korea where the most population consists of 100% Koreans, you know what I mean? At least, in the US, you call it diversity…with the population of many different people from everywhere.

It’s just my thought though. ;)

Comment by Dan Mehlhorn

19 March 2004 @ 3:45 am

Jae,

Isn’t one of the worst personal insults in Korea is to tell a person that they look Japanese or a little too Japanese?

Some Koreans say my daughter has a Japanese nose.

Comment by Jeff in Korea

19 March 2004 @ 5:12 am

Dan,

Then again, the store security camera clearly shows the girl walking toward the counter when the owner grabbed the girl’s bag and accused her of stealing juice. the girl then slapped at the store owner a few times. As the girl was walking away from the owner and out the door, the Korean store owner shot and killed the girl.

Personally, if someone accuses me of stealing and grabs my bag, they had better be prepared to get smacked a few times.

You call the cops. You don’t shoot a girl in the back as she is walking out of your store. THAT is not self defense. That is murder from hate and anger.

Jeff

Comment by Scott

19 March 2004 @ 5:19 am

Dan,

I recently had a new Japanese student join my class of high-level English students. He’s a medical-school student and an accomplished guy, in english and otherwise.

During his self-introduction to the class, he commented on how some people said he looked similar to the indigenous people of northern Japan. After everyone chuckled an older man in class (the leader in Japanese situations like this) made a derogatory joke, the student emphasized how he wasn’t happy about folks making snide (read: un-necessary) remarks like that. It reminded me of my years at a nearly all-black elementary school: the light-skinned black kids had it worse than the white kids.

My guess: Many folks can’t handle anything outside of their normal existence. And many folks live in a small, small world, indeed.

Comment by Jae

19 March 2004 @ 5:19 am

Dan,

I agree… Well, I got that a couple times… Before I moved, some Korean people (this was back in Boston) said that they didn’t know I was Korean, but they thought I was something else (various responses, such as Japanese or Chinese)…

I mean, it’s everywhere… People judge you who you are based on what they think you look like. I don’t take it as an insult, because I just have no control over people out there, who don’t know me.

Comment by stavrosthewonderchicken

19 March 2004 @ 9:32 am

Some more discussion here ( http://joi.ito.com/archives/2004/03/17/racial_stereotypes_in_korean_newspaper.html ) …

Comment by serpent

19 March 2004 @ 9:47 am

How about the ugly caricature of Chinese by Koreans in the same cartoon as well as in stage plays such as THE LAST EMPRESS and jajeongmyun restaurant mascots. Koreans in China and Hongkong are always uncomfortable at meeting Chinese girls who happen to have a more delicate bone structure in addition to comparable beauty.

Comment by Brian

19 March 2004 @ 10:18 am

Better get your facts right, Jeff. That was Ice Cube, not Ice-T.

You never seemed like that much of a hip-hop fan when we met… now I now it’s true:)

Brian

Comment by don bell

19 March 2004 @ 1:05 pm

Another recent faux pax by Korean marketing, if you live here in Korea, a series of cookies, candy, etc. that shows the Hanja (Chinese) character Mi, “self”, followed by “in Black”. It is, I was told by my Korean students, roughly translated “I, in black”. I think they meant “I am Black” because very primitive African cartoon charactors lampooning Black people adorn the Crown company’s packaging. A dinasaur laying dead is pointed at by an African boy who’s head looks like a penis! Most students laugh at the images…then admit that it makes fun of black people. Korean know what they are doing, they are not ignorant, like the Bubble Sisters tried to deny that they understood that their “Blackface” routine would insult. I am going to scan the images and send it to some of the Black forums to expose these prejudiced bastards and uncover their blatant practices.

Comment by Silly Sally

19 March 2004 @ 5:02 pm

Jeff,

How dare you say Koreans are ignorant! They know what they are doing. Yes, I am talking about Koreans in general: this is a cookie-cutter society — they are cloned by traditionalism.

Your expose is implicitly racist: you imply Koreans lack the moral capacity to appreciate their rudeness — as if they are an ignorant race with one foot in the rice paddies: and the other in a modern office building.

Koreans are not ignorant — they are immoral.

Quit being such a mealy-mouthed bigot about it all and say it plainly!

By the way, is it true you over-heard a Korean say you are too fat to have sex? Not, that there is anything wrong with that — being too fat.

Oh, I am sorry! Was I being rude? Really, I didn’t know, excuse my ignorance!

Think of me as being Korean — if that makes it easier to excuse away.

Comment by Christopher

20 March 2004 @ 1:49 am

There is certainly a reason why you name yourself “Silly Sally.”

It is interesting now how cries of racism are being used for gain. Look at the Omarosa woman from The Apprentice or the college professor who vandalized and wrote racial and sexual and regiligous hate speech on her own car. It’s getting ridiculous how society is freaked out dealing with anything about race. I’m as non PC as most but at the same time you can’t go overboard like this cartoon does.

Comment by Jackie

20 March 2004 @ 1:51 am

Don Bell: Me in Blck means “beauty in black” (Me= chinese character “beauty,” NOT “self”) :)

Comment by Silly Sally

20 March 2004 @ 12:11 pm

Jeff,

I agree. I can also see you look through satire pretty easily.

Yes, the race card is being “used” for many illegitimate purposes these days. There is developing a social environment allowing the usurpation of society’s well-intended conscience as a weapon for personal self-aggrandizement. The Twana Brawly syndrome.

Such as the attention and empowerment the white woman at Claremont College recently obtained when she vandalized her own vehicle and claimed white racist persecution. Too bad she got caught by eye-witnesses: she could have been an upcoming civil rights activist star. Just another white TWANA BRAWLY. Reputation down the tubes for her: probably in her mind a white conspiracy to keep the brother and sister down.

Watch out,also, for the HATE STUDIES movement: this too will be “used” to aggrandize the scholars, politicians, and beneficiaries of envy politics.

Finally, Koreans are not so “ignorant” as we want to suppose; they — are simply racist — and could care less about its perniciousness. That is what simple folk call — immoral.

Silly Sally

Comment by don bell

21 March 2004 @ 5:21 pm

Jackie,
Thanks for the correction, I also checked with other students and learned that the charactor is “Beauty” in Black. I am still outraged at the blatant racism here, by the way, I was born in Korea during the Korean war, my father was American and came here to give the people of my Korean birthmother freedom. But I am ready to get out after all the anti-American crap here the last two years.
By the way, Jeff your blog is great, if you every come up to Seoul, let me buy you a drink.

Trackback by Budaechigae 부대찌개

22 March 2004 @ 12:33 am

Link Buffet (or I’m too tired to post…)

Since I have a brief, Sunday repose, (read: I’m now at home on a non-government, post-safe computer…) I’d like to take this opportunity to share some links, and some thoughts on what has happened in the last week. Bad news

Comment by kimchipig

22 March 2004 @ 1:22 am

This has been beat to death but…

Koreans see themselves from the point of view of cultural and racial uniqueness. Japanese feel exactly the same way.

However, Japanese know that rude and racist comments, or portraying racist images in the media, is wrong although they still sometimes do it. Koreans do not. They have never even considered it.

I live in a city where 60% of the population is non-white. However, I would wager that 99.9% of the people here know how important it is to try to get along with each other. Thus, racist incidents are quite few but I am sure they happen. The years of education in regards to this subject seem to have helped.

Comment by Dan Mehlhorn

22 March 2004 @ 11:46 pm

Jeff,

Ther black girl had left and come back to slam the bottle of juice down on the counter. Who is to say that the Korean woman wasn’t afraid of another return of the black girl?

Everyone is so quick to dismiss the assault of the black girl.

Jeff, I don’t know you or your background, but do you know how often Korean store owners are assaulted in Los Angeles and Orange County? If the assailant is Black, they shout racism at the arrest, to the media, any crowds, and especially to any cameras in the vacinity.

The racist thing about the whole situation is that Blacks in these areas do no wrong, and the media reinforces that.

Comment by Jeff in Korea

23 March 2004 @ 1:24 am

So, Dan, your argument is: That person might come back, and because i am frightened that she may come back, I have no choice but to shoot her? I hope not.

No one said that no blacks to wrong. People of all colors do things wrong. I this case, I Korean storeowner shooting a teenage girl in the back did something wrong. Had the girl pulled a knife, gut, bat, rock, pointed stick, or some other weapon, then by all means, gun her down. Unless your life is threatened in some way, you don’t shoot someone. You certainly don’t shoot people because they took or even tried to take a bottle of juice and slapped you when you tried to grab their bag. By your own admission, the confrontation was done. The girl returned the juice that she was going to pay for in the first place and was on her way out when she got blasted in the back. THAT sort of irresponsible behavior is what leads to these cries for gun control.

For whatever reason, Many Koreans choose to do business in high-crime areas, and even operate liquor stores in such areas (there’s fuel for the fire). There is a risk associated with doing that sort of business. It is not just Koreans in those areas that get robbed or assaulted. Black, white, brown and any other color store owners doing business in those locations get it too…and not just from blacks. Koreans, mexicans, white americans, and people of every other race commit crimes too.

None of this changes the fact that Koreans in Korea, and perhaps elsewhere have a major problem with blacks in general. Many Many people have told me how scary black people are. When I ask what a black person ever did to them or anyone they know to make the scared of black people, the answer is always, “uh…..nothing….” See Silly Sallies comments above for a bitter, but largely accurate pill to swallow.

Comment by Dan Mehlhorn

23 March 2004 @ 3:36 am

Jeff,

Not many Koreans can come to America and open shop on Rodeo Dr. The Koreans in the US that I’ve met work damn hard and keep to themselves. They open shops where they can afford to and sell what the locals will buy. It is not their fault the store owners don’t have any more buying power than to go to warehouse stores like Costco to get stock for their shelves. That does make their prices higher than the big grocery chains that buy direct from the manufacturer and have their own distibution warehouses.

I’ve heard it over and over again that the Koreans gouge the black community. That Korean just take from the black community. When people in the black community actually accept a job in a Korean’s store, they are expected to work like a Korean at the same wages paid a korean, but that isn’t good enough for them.

The 92 riots were justified by the black community, led by Maxine Waters, as getting even with the Koreans.

While I grant you, Jeff, that the store owner shouldn’t have shot Letisha in the back of the head, neither should the black community shield their criminals who go into stores and shoot first, rob later.

Before you start in on another tangent, I know damn well that they don’t target just Korean stores. My wife and children were assaulted by a couple of “Compton Heroes” down to Anaheim to get paid. They came into a Clothworld store put a knife to my wife’s throat and to the cashier’s throat. The cashier had only been on the job a couple of days. These heroes not only put knives to these womens’ throats, they also threatened to slash their crotches. When the cops were coming, these brazen heroes pushed 9 month old Brenda (Sung Mee) in her stroller over on her 6 year old sister as they left. I supposed the girls were a major threat to the Compton Heroes.

Comment by Sloanie

25 March 2004 @ 9:21 am

Korea is just behind the times. Rewind American history and see how blacks were treated even 50 years ago.. I can’t begin to understand why they were treated that way, it’s disgusting and ridiculous. Not that racism doesn’t exist today in the states, it’s just not as universal as it seems to be in Korea.

Comment by Bernard Moon

26 March 2004 @ 12:24 pm

Another short take… I believe Koreans are the second most racist people in Asia after the Japanese.

http://bernardmoon.blogspot.com/2004_02_29_bernardmoon_archive.html#107845434001275158

Comment by H. Kim

27 March 2004 @ 9:11 am

Jeff & SillySally:
Koreans are neither racist, ignorant or immoral. These are just ridiculous and absurd generalizations and racial stereotypes that show your own racism.

Can you people get off your self-righteous, hypocritical, bigoted flaming against the Koreans for once in a while? As an American, I am sick and tired of people, especially other Americans, automatically playing the race card and acting holier than thou whenever their pc sensibilities are offeneded in Korea.

Yes Korea is very ‘un-pc’ about a lot of things, but then again, Korea is not America. And just b/c Koreans don’t see a black-and-white world like many race-obsessed Americans do doesn’t mean that that Koreans are “ignorant”. Koreans can be narrow minded. They can also be xenophobic. These traits are the byproduct of having a ethnically homogenous and sealed off society until the middle of the 20th Century. and they can b. Korean culture and indigenous.

I also disagree that Koreans are “immoral”. This is just another absurd racial generalization. Are you really naive to believe that your race or national origin determines your morality or lack thereof? C’mon people, stop acting like a bunch of racist assholes. While Korean native religious beliefs are amoral by nature, being ‘amoral’ is entirely different than being immoral — which Americans probably reign supreme in.

Making broad generalizations that a group of people are ‘racist’, ‘immoral’ and ‘ignorant’ based on their race or nationality, are inherently racist and bigoted stereotypes that impugn the intelligence of those having to be subjected to such idiocy and hypocrisy.

In fact, I daresay that such comments are in fact an expression of your own hypocrisy, racism and bigotry.

A suggestion: if you don’t like Korea or the Korean people, please leave — you are very welcomed to do so.

Comment by Jeff in Korea

27 March 2004 @ 12:23 pm

First of all, Mr. Kim,if you maintain the assertion that Koreans are not racist, then you are in serious denial. The vast majority of Koreans are racist, racism being defined as ”
Discrimination or prejudice based on race.”

There are different kinds of racism; that borne of hate, that born of ignorance (look up the meaning of that word, by the way), and that born of a feeling of superiority.

I have met very few Koreans who have hate-based racism. However,racism born of feelings of superiority and ignorance of others is everywhere in Korean society? As an example of this, do you honestly think that almost all Koreans, or even 1 in 10 Korean parents would welcome the idea of a foreign son-in-law or daughter-in-law into the family at first mention? What if little Su-jin brought home a black man and said, “mom…dad…He and I love each other and want to get married?” Be honest. what would the reaction of virtually every last Korean parent be?

This is pure racial prejudice. This is from that sense of superiority that most Koreans have that they are the best in the world. You are not Korean. Therefore, you are not good enough for my daughter/son…and if you are black, it is worse.

This is also racism based on ignorance, which (since I know you didn’t look it up) it is defined as “lacking eduction or knowledge, unaware, uninformed”). By and large, Koreans are unaware, uninformed, and lacking in knowledge about how people in other countries and cultures ACTUALLY live. They are unaware, uninformed, and uneducated about what is unacceptable to others.

It does not make them bad people. It simply means that they are ignorant on the subject. Once Koreans are forced to deal with a situation on a personal and individual basis, a great many come around to the idea that a foreigner is a person too and probably a good person at that. n That is the whole assertion of this piece; the Korean prejudice against blacks is irrational and comes from not having had any direct experience with black people. there are relatively few Koreans who have ever laid eyes on a black person in real life, yet virtually every Korean has an opinion about blacks. Test me. Go ask.

It is you, Mr. Kim, not me, that put the negative spin on the word “ignorant”. In your post above, you state “Koreans can be narrow minded. They can also be xenophobic. These traits are the byproduct of having a ethnically homogenous and sealed off society until the middle of the 20th Century. and they can b. Korean culture and indigenous.” Look at the definitition of “ignorant”. You have just defined the term “ignorant”…narrow-minded, xenophobic (which by the way, is an irrational fear of foreigners..which is what my post is about….thank you very much), homogenous, and sealed off.

I am ignorant of a great many things, but that doesn’t mean I am a bad person. It just means that I have some learing to do on a variety of subjects.

As for being immoral, show me where I have said that all Koreans are immoral. By the way, I agree whole-heartedly with your distinction between amoral and immoral, and with you application of it to Korean society.

While you are at it, I defy you to show one example of “self-righteous, hypocritical, bigoted flaming” that I have done on this blog.

I have to ask why and how you came to the juvenile and foul-mouthed conclusions that you did (racist asshole??? Come on. Is that kind of language called for?)

How much of my site did you read? What did you find to be self-righteous, hypocritical, bigoted flaming? I challenge you to find one negative thing I have written about Korean culture. The times I have been critical, I have been critical about specific people or groups such as corrupt politicians, whining sports figures, lawless and inhumane demonstrators, tests that cause little girls to throw themselves off buildings, institutional prejudice and racism, etc. These are not culture or country specific. I could write about them in any country in which I happened to find myself. However, as I am in Korea, I write about Korea and the things that affect Korea.

Again, I don’t know what you think you have seen on my site that makes you think I complain about Korea culture. I have no right to complain about Korea culture. I have no right to criticize a culture. However, as a fifteen year resident of this country who loves this place and wants Korea to prosper and be much more successful than it currently is, I have every right to speak out against illegal and damaging activities and behavior.

I have not said that the American way is the right way and that Koreans should do what Americans do. However, I believe that there is right and wrong, and that if someone does something wrong, they should be called on it and admonished to change, not to some other country’s way, but to the right way.

When did I ever say that I didn’t like Korea or Koreans? Please tell me on what grounds you believe me to think that way? To say, “if you don’t like it, please leave” is such a childish and dismissive thing to say. What kind of solution is that?

As I said above, it is not that I do not like Korea that I am critical of aspects of Korean society, it is because I love Korea and Koreans and have chosen to make this place my home. It is because I love Korea that I want her to change the self-defeating and harmful aspects of society…to make herself better. Notice I did not say “more like the USA”. I said, to be better. Right and wrong are not monopolies owned by a single country or race.

I honestly would like to know why you think I engage in self-righteous, hypocritical, bigoted flaming all the time.

I would really like to hear where you are coming from with your comments about me. Please write back and let me have some examples of what you are talking about. Perhaps you could also be less judgmental, accusatory, assuming, and rude, so as to keep the path of constructive dialog open.

I really do look forward to hearing from you.

Comment by Bernard

27 March 2004 @ 6:23 pm

Good points, Jeff. Koreans (of course generalizing) are pretty racist. I’ve encountered similar racism as a Korean American that lived 26 out of 33 years of my life in the U.S., so I can say the same about “Middle America” especially when I lived in Springfield, IL for two years. In the same way that people combat ignorance and racism in the U.S., it should be combated here.

It’s ridiculous and blinding to say that Koreans are not racist, and many of my Korean and Korean American friends will agree. The problem with some Koreans (e.g. HKim) is that they fail to take responsibility or blame. The most common phrase I hate in Korea is “Oh, we don’t do that here… It’s not the Korean way.” A model of complacency and hindrance to change. My parents, who are “Korean of Koreans” (joke/play on Apostle Paul), also agree. Nationalism should never blind people to a nation’s own problems or faults. I personally was disturbed and disappoint when the economic crisis of 1997 was called the IMF Crisis by Koreans. This was reflective of the attitude I am talking about. The general thinking was not to take responsibility of the country’s failure, but to place blame on the IMF. If there was weed or a drug problem in Korea, I could easily excuse many people from doing that too much but they weren’t so the next rationale conclusion for me is an extreme national pride and an intangible cultural factor that prevents Koreans from taking a sincere responsibility for their mistakes and actions.

Comment by H. Kim

27 March 2004 @ 9:41 pm

Bernard:
You are what we call in the Korean-American community an “Uncle Tom.” I took a look at your Web site and you are typical of those greedy arrogant and self-righteous gyopos who come to Korea and think you are better then everybody else. You are obviously here not to contribute and help make Korean society a better place for all to live, but to get rich quick and to take advantage of others. Please be advised that your ill-advised comments do not represent the feelings of Korean Americans either in Korea or anywhere else.

Jeff:
Xenophobia is different from racism. While both breed discrimination, they are different in their origins. Xenophobia is based on fear and ignorance, while racism is based on hatred and ignorance. Are Koreans hateful of foreigners? Maybe some, but not all. Are Koreans xenophobic? I think this is closer to the truth. However, if you want to say that Koreans are “racist” or “ignorant”, that is your perogative. But your gross generalization and blanket condemnation of an entire group really erode your overall credibility. I should think that as a lawyer, you would know that. Personally, I would opt for the safer ’some Koreans can be racist or ignorant….’ I have no contention with that type of statement.

Also, I will give you credit for being quite knowledgeable and up-to-date about Korean society. However, it doesn’t appear that you have any great love for Korea or its people. There are plenty of negative things that you have to say about Korea, most of which I will say are undoubtedly true. However, where are the good and positive things? Maybe I missed them, but if you include those things as well, maybe your overall credibility would be enhanced.

Comment by Bernard

28 March 2004 @ 6:41 pm

H. Kim, you don’t know anything about me, so how can you make such statements? So I will make some conclusions about you. You are a typical loser who makes excuses for himself and others without contributing. You probably attend rallies and complain about various issues in Korea, but have done really nothing to create solutions. What have you done? Tell me. Show me some proof. Typical Loser. I don’t respect talkers only doers. What have you done for Korea or the Korean American community?

I started a national organization for Korean Americans that holds an annual conference in the U.S. (www.kascon.com) that discusses political and social issues. It brings forth forward leaders to combat racism, ignorance, and lazy asses like yourself to actually create change for the better. I created a professional training programs for Korean Americans to help them succeed in the U.S. I’ve raised thousands of dollars for charities in the U.S., and for non-profit organizations in Korea(e.g. homesless shelter) during my short four years here. I started the Yonsei Christian Fellowship here during a summer in college with some friends that has become a lasting organization for 14 years now. I encourage my family members who are native Koreans that have dreams and aspirations to change Korea and they will since I will for Korean Americans in the U.S. after I move back this year. I know for certain my parents alone have done more than your whole family has for Korea and Korean Americans in the U.S., so I won’t even start to embarrass you.

I can confidently state I know more Korean Americans in Korea and the U.S. than you do, so I can say that my feelings represent the majority… probably know more Koreans too since you seem like the type that doesn’t have many friends. If you actually have any reach into this community, just ask about me and you will find out. My friends and I are a main social and
professional hub here. Look in Friendster.com or Linkedin.com.

Greedy? None of my friends or colleagues have ever called me such. I worked in government in the U.S. half my career, so money has never
been my ambition. I will always go back and forth between government and business. I’ve been successful in both, so please don’t hate me
for that. What have you done? Hahaha… you’re like a little child arguing and calling people names without any substance. Either your
IQ is like a child’s or the development of your personality has stopped during the fifth grade.

Generalizing, Koreans are racist, and you’re a racist, dimwitted Korean.

Comment by seaofjapan

28 March 2004 @ 7:36 pm

To Bernard,

The irony of the dimwitted koreans comments to you should not be lost. “Uncle Tom” for those of you who have not read the book by Harriet Beecher Stowe was kind, forgiving, strong and capable. He was a good man who was loved by all that knew him. The servile depiction came about years later on the stage and screen but its not in the text.

People like the dimwitted korean are looking up from the bottom of a well and see people like you as a threat. But instead of climbing out of the well they want to drag you in it with them.

seaofjapan

Comment by hardyandtiny

30 March 2004 @ 8:05 pm

Korea doesn’t care much about those things, they can always say it’s America’s fault…somehow?

here’s my version
http://hardyandtiny.typepad.com/general/2004/03/post.html

Comment by Dan Mehlhorn

31 March 2004 @ 5:40 am

H Kim,

I am genuinely interested in how you perceive the average Korean parent will react if their child brings home a “returnee” who doesn’t speak Korean that they want to marry?

Please don’t limit your response to American returnees. Think of Dutch, German, Sweedish, mixed heritage returnees.

Comment by Silly Sally

31 March 2004 @ 5:02 pm

Jeff and Bernard,

Both of you have violated Article 88 of the Uniform Code of Multicultural Justice:
“No white man nor “Uncle Tom” Korean shall critique Koreans unless it flatters them.”

Eg. “Korea is ‘number one’ in traffic and pedestrian death rates for all OECD countries.”

(Korean nationals only hear the part “number one” and feel innately satisfied.)

You failed to re-word your statement as such:
” Koreans are the number one racists of the world and Japan is only number two.”

For such incorrect wording I think H.Kim intends to prosecute — you need to hire a good lawyer.

Comment by Jeff in Korea

31 March 2004 @ 5:07 pm

Whew…. Good thing I AM a good lawyer. Saves me from having to pay myself my huge fees for my amazingly competent services.

Comment by Silly Sally

1 April 2004 @ 4:07 pm

Oh, I didn’t know you are a lawyer!

Are you married?

Er, wait a minute, what I mean is — do you make alot of money?

(I just exposed my fish-net stocking leg for you — don’t look — grrr…you ARE randy!)

Comment by bradster

2 April 2004 @ 3:28 pm

Am I messed up because I actually just looked at that picture and actually laughed. There is no sense in getting mad about the small things, as long as a person doesn’t go hands on, I guess you can blow it off. As a 1/2 Breed, I ran into the situation of being called the magic N word by whites, and a white boy, zebra cracker by the brothers… and then everybody else had something to say too. It wasn’t until I was shipped od to Cuba the people thought I was one of them.

Comment by pipes

22 April 2004 @ 7:17 pm

hey f*** u bi*ches..

come into my shop, may it be a liquor, laundry,
whatever…you might be korean, black, white..

you dis-respect me or even look like your gonna steal shit…

i’ll shoot you, straight out.

think “menace to society” gonna happen to me..

fuck u, i don’t care what the fuck you are…..

come near me, i’ll get u.

Comment by steve

8 June 2004 @ 11:16 am

My in-laws (Korean) own a beauty supply store in LA…in a not so nice area. They are treated like crap by the blacks…they have to follow them around the store or they steal them blind, they have been accosted in front of their store, they are called names, spit upon…you name it. All my in-laws want to do is make a decent living. For this they get shit on on almost daily. Two storefronts down is a nail salon run by Chinese. When we were visiting our daughters wanted to get their nails done. The manicurists are all Chinese and the clientele is all black. The crudeness displayed by the customers is astounding. One very well dressed black lady came in and demanded immediate service for a nail she broke. My daughters were truly amazed. Interestingly enough, there was little visiting between the manicurists and the blacks. But they swooned over my daughters and joked with them. Now, why do you suppose that is?
The bottomline is my in-laws invariable voice their disgust of blacks to me everytime we visit. So before anyone goes hammering on the lady who killed the thief maybe they need to look at the dynamics on how the customers treat the storeowners DAILY. Once you figure that out, you may understand why the storeowner did what she did.

Comment by Jeff in Korea

8 June 2004 @ 11:32 am

Well, I think the important thing to understand is that the girl was not a thief. The store owner THOUGHT she was GOING to steal something. She was shot in the back while trying to leave the store empty handed. Let’s review:

Girl picks up juice walks around store.
Store owner thinks girl will steal juice.
store owner grabs girls bag and tries to hold it.
Girl slaps store owner (which I would do too).
Girl puts juice on counter and starts to walk out.
Store owner shoots unarmed teenage girl who stole nothing in the back.
store owner goes to jail.
Done deal.

Nothing justifies that shooting. Nothing at all. You can’t shoot people you think might steal in the back. Even if they steal from you, you cannot shoot them. As I said, teenage girl whips out a knife, gun, rock, or even a pointed stick, then by all means, blow her away. But not for what this teenage girl did.

Thank God Koreans don’t have guns.

Comment by nick

8 June 2004 @ 12:05 pm

haha omfg, in every country there are people that are racist in some way and they post shit up on the internet and shit. Just cause some korean kid or person or group of them in korea have anti black feelings that doesn’t mean, “korea and their anti black sentiments” and all that bullshit. America has their KKK, japs got their anti-korean groups, so why don’t we all just write an article titled, “anti korean and anti-asian sentiments in USA and JAPAN. and shit

Comment by TC

28 June 2004 @ 12:36 pm

I say good going for the Koreans, here in America blacks do everything they can to disrupt everyones lives, and then blame everyone else for their inadequacies.. besides asian-americans are my best weapon against the race card, asians are the minority with the least numbers and representation in this country,yet they are on top in almost all statistics measuring advancements by race…. so I say reload Ms. Korean shop owner…

Comment by Sugar Shin

28 June 2004 @ 7:03 pm

TC,

the Asian immigrants in the USA have an advantageous starting point over there. They don’t have to live with the stigma of centuries-old domestic slavery practice and racial segregation. The Asian-Amercans can trace back their ethnical roots and form communities of solidarity based on nationality or ethnical origin like Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, Vietnamese etc. The Afro-Americans had lost their ethnical bonds to their African countries of origin a long time ago. If you would know the sad history and struggle of black Americans, you wouldn’t type such racist crap.

Comment by Zdunk

28 June 2004 @ 9:28 pm

Jeff,

Actually, it was not \”a few slaps\” Latasha Harlins gave SoonJa Du, - it was caught on camera and i watched it - but rather 5-7 closed-fist punches to the head. There are next-day pictures from of Mrs. Du with one massive black eye and the other one looking like it was next.

Now, Jeff, remember, this was about a 180 pound young girl beating the shit out of a grandmother who had plucked at her bag. So, sorry, but how would you feel if that was YOUR grandmother who got assaulted? If you research the background into that story, and the accounts of the vile, vicious assholery that family endured for months from the black community, well…I came to the conclusion that the assault finally snapped the old woman. Latasha Harlins didn\’t deserve to die for acting as low as she did, but….cry a river for her? No way.

Comment by Scott-in-Japan

29 June 2004 @ 12:19 am

SS - The ’sad history’ is just that…history. If your (I say this generically) ancestors came to the USA over 10 generations ago, then your place in life is up to you and your parents.

TC is correctly pointing out that the culture of victimhood is what separates the two cultures. Comparing notes from activity over 150 years ago is irrelevant.

Comment by Sugar Shin

29 June 2004 @ 3:35 am

And the racial segregation in the Southern states stopped, when? In the 60s with the civil rights movement, but that didn’t mean, that racism against the black minority was totally rooted out till then. I disagree with you, Scott-in-Japan, that the experience of slavery, discrimination and segregation by the (dominantly white) society had not any consequences for the self-esteem (psychological scars and anger about the historical injustice) and motivation for the Afro-American community to seek for societal success, acknowledgment and economical ascension (besides the typical careers in the show and sports business for black Americans) like other immigrant minorities.

“…so I say reload Ms. Korean shop owner…” TC

This cynical sentence makes me simply sick.

Comment by Scott-in-Japan

29 June 2004 @ 6:15 am

“…consequences for the self-esteem … and motivation the Afro-American community…”
That’s the real issue - motivation. The early 1800s saw some extremely successful & infulential blacks. Why? They were motivated.

The only shackles holding back a black person in Los Angeles are psychological and self-imposed. Is there some form of discrimination against blacks by some Americans? Absolutely. But the amount is woefully small.

The real barrier to black success is black people themselves. If you want to read cynical sentences that simply make you sick, read speeches by Jesse Jackson. His “can’t do” attitude for the black community is wrong, but widely accepted by those he ‘preaches’ to help.

“…slavery, discrimination and segregation”
These respectively ended in the south about 150-, 30- and 40-years ago. The north has been longer than that.

Comment by Kevin-aroundthe world

14 September 2004 @ 1:06 pm

it’s hard to comment when you havent walked in a person’s shoes, mental slavery is something very real but i do agree that the race card is pulled too often these days, however you cannot deny the fact that society affects us blacks. i came to north america from an african country with a good background education and i am successful in a white society, my brother came at a younger age and spend most of his childhood here, as a result he has grown up like most black kids in north america,hopeless.

why? we have the same parents etc, the only change was our social environment, there are times when even i feel hopelessly lost and long for a change in my people but i fully understand what its like to be lost because i fight the feeling everyday, it bothers me to feel like i’m posing in somebody’s lifestyle and world that does not belong to me so for those that say slavery is over, it goes deeper than that slavery was just the beginning what it left behind in our minds is long-lasting

Comment by ill wil

15 September 2004 @ 1:49 pm

I am sick and tired of all you Koreans and Asians in general calling people of African ancestry stupid and animals. If you hate us so much I have a great idea; STAY THE HELL AWAY FROM US. White people do. Every time I walk to the store there is a Korean, every time I want my clothes professionally cleaned there is a Korean, I go to a predominately black college the faculty is predominately black and who do I see everyday Koreans and other third world fifth. If Koreans are so great why does Korea smell like feces oh yeah I have been to many Asian countries Korea, Taiwan etc… via the US Army even the Philippines and that country’s economic level is no where near on par with Korea but it doesn’t smell like feces. That smell may come from all that damn kimchi you people eat

Comment by steve

20 September 2004 @ 9:33 pm

Hey Kevin !!
Third world Koreans? Korea is the number 12 economy in the world and is predicted to overtake the U.K. The Koreans come to your filthy neighborhoods and have enough ambition and capital to open a business there. Congratulations you singlehandedly managed to perpetuate negative images of both blacks and US military in less than 200 words!!………silly grunt.

Comment by ill wil

28 September 2004 @ 3:25 am

Hey Steve either you are some self-righteous cracker or are some Korean with a name like Steve who wants to be white Korea is still considered a third world country do your home work before you speak boy http://www.nationsonline.org/oneworld/third_world.htm

Comment by levente

30 September 2004 @ 2:47 am

o.k. i’ve gotta say something. usually i don’t say anything but the blatant disrespect and outright ignorance here is overwhelming. first and formost i would like to say that i am graduate student studying at sejong univ. in seoul. also i am african american. i must say that after reading some of the things at this sight that my ill feelings about korea and america have been perpetuated ten fold. in all my travels around the world i have never experienced such blatant attacks upon myself for no other reason than being black as i have in korea. we are all racist to a degree but the difference between living in korea versus living in another asian country (such as japan) is that people are tactful enough to keep there feelings to themselves and there mouths closed. i don’t care who u are or where u are from no one can say that the things that are said about black people and the images that are created and perpetuated in korea are acceptable. secondly, as i am preparing to write my thesis about certain things that are korean (good things might i add) koreans wonder why they have such a turbulant history of existance especially within the last 200 years. look at how u treat each other. look at this website and how koreans differentiate amongst one another. look at how u talk to and treat one another just because one guy was born in america or comes from this type of family speaks or does not speak a certain language. korea will allways be a dependent nation as long as it is divided along these lines. the racism that exist in korea against non koreans begins with the basic division u have between each other. (i.e. african american community) if koreans want to learn how not to act take a good look at the african american community. almost 200 hundred years removed from slavery and look at us. this is my point; our communities come from the same type of oppressive history yet we do our best to find differences between ourselves. korea must realize that and also the african american community must recognize the same thing. i must honestly say that by living in korea and experiencing the things i have here, that i see clearly now the ills within my own community a lot better.

i would highly recommend everyone here find and read a book called “the chains and images of psychological slavery” by Dr. Jawanzza Kunjufu: the book was written for the african american community but i think we all stand something to learn from it. if u are korean and u read this book try to look at the ideas in this book from a korean perspective. alright gotta go said too much or maybe not enough.

p.s. be intelligent enough not to expose urself unless u don’t care.

Comment by Scott-in-Japan

30 September 2004 @ 5:01 pm

Levente -

“Our communities come from the same type of oppressive history” No they didn’t - Koreans were oppressed at home, kidnapped Africans (with the help of other Africans) were taken to other countries.

Yes, there is some intra-Korean friction - but that is between the Communists/Fascits/Hippies versus Everyone Else. And the USA has that. So do all the free (more or less) countries of the world).

I agree with your sentiment, to a degree, but…. a little high-school spelling skill (’turbulant’, ‘existance’) would help. As would some capital letters. I can let the grammar slide, to a point. As for the spelling - either you’re a troll or just an incapable person (although I sadly believe you are an American college student).

As for the bad behavior you’ve seen in Korea…. didn’t you do any research before you came? It’s not like insane Korean behavior is a secret.

Comment by Jeff in Korea

1 October 2004 @ 1:26 am

Scott.

A huge number of Koreans were “relocated” by Stalin from North Korea to Sakhalin, Uzbekistan, and to Siberia to perform labor.

Koreans have been oppressed abroad by the Soviets and are still being oppressed and repressed by the Japanese in Japan.

As for internal friction in Korean being “between the Communists/Fascits/Hippies versus Everyone Else,” That is a very, very small portion. The majority of friction internally in Korean is between people from different regions….particularly Cheolla and Kyoungsang provinces. This friction is DEEPLY rooted. just look at the voting patterns in the two regions for the previous three presidential elections.

Additionally, there is friction between different families. Koreans have five families that were traditionally slave-class families. Even today, those families are looked down on.

As for spelling criticisms, that is a bit much. This is my site, and I generally don’t give a crap about my spelling or punctuation. I seldom use spell check. It is just not that important to me. If some client is paying me a couple hundred bucks an hour, then I care about spelling and punctuation…otherwise… no. I don’t expect it from myself and I certainly don’t care about other people’s spelling in my comments.

Comment by Scott-in-Japan

2 October 2004 @ 1:40 pm

Jeff - As for the spelling, my pet peeve. Long run-on paragraphs (etc) make it difficult to read, and give the impression ‘this was typed randomly and might not have a point’.

Thanks for the historical info, I wasn’t aware of any of that. Except for the Japanese mistreatment - I see that a lot.

As for the regional differences, I wasn’t aware they were that bad. I always get crap when visiting my southern relatives - especially when traveling alone. But I’m sure my reception is mild compared to what goes on abroad.

Comment by Glow2

29 November 2004 @ 1:10 am

I’m not going to even try to be a nice person here. Most of Korea sucks. Call me racist if you want. I have travelled to many countries and have never seen such blatent racism as I do in this country…little brat Korean kids running around chanting “Fuckin’ USA” and outrageous comment by low-class Korean taxi drivers. They think the world owes them something, especially the U.S and I’m sick of them with their whiny accents griping about Paul Hamm and the olympics and how great their Samsung phones are and how that they are going to be the next world superpower (I laugh, how many people bother to know about their culture). I spend over a year in Korea, hated from the basic start because of the racism here, and am planning to bolt. Yes, I don’t like Korea and plan on leaving. So good you have people like me out. But I don’t understand the other foreigners sometimes who complain and complain about Korea and spend 10+ years here. I say if you hate Korea, get out, because the longer you stay the more this place will drive you crazy.

Comment by steve

2 December 2004 @ 5:26 am

Most of Korea does not suck…you just haven’t a clue. I read postings which paint Koreans and Korea in a negative light and chuckle because all you types do is want to play the “victim” when in fact you are the root cause. It isn’t them…it is you.

Lets face it, black Americans are masters at this because they have been conditioned by the likes of Jackson and Sharpton. Everywhere they go the want to be immediately gauged on their blackness…which is all they dwell on…and not their personal attributes away from color. Oh, they tell you differently, but their actions bely this.

I spent too many years in Asian countries watching this to feel otherwise. To the supposed idiot student preparing to do his thesis but can’t spell…you are the perfect example of the victim mentality….just another Asian or white man trying to keep the black man down.

Comment by Glow2

4 December 2004 @ 3:46 am

Steve,

Just because you have some weird “fetish” with Asian countries or Korea doesn’t mean you have to bash the ones that have bad experiences. Good. I’m glad you like Korea so much, stay there. I don’t think I’m a ‘victim”…I know I have choices and I chose to leave. Also, Korea isn’t just racist towards Blacks….if you aren’t Korean period, they say crap about you…either you don’t understand Korean when they make jokes about you or they say it behind your back. I’m not saying that there aren’t good Koreans…I have met some wonderful people. But the general attitude of this country is that they don’t like you and use you for English practice. Good luck.

Comment by ill will

11 December 2004 @ 3:17 am

October 1, 2002 — It happened again, for what seems like the millionth time.

Once again, in response to something I said about ongoing racism in the U.S., someone (a white male, naturally) pulled out the all-too-common conservative race card which they believe disproves the existence of racial injustice. It sounds a bit like this:

If racism is such a big deal in America, then why have Asians done so well? Why is Asian income higher than white income? And doesn’t this prove that the real problem with blacks is their own lack of effort?
Offered this challenge most recently by a disgruntled county employee in Minneapolis who resented having to sit through a speech I had given, I rolled my eyes, took a deep breath and considered the irony of the query (ironic because it always comes from whites who insist on their “color-blindness”) before issuing my reply.

As I pondered my response:

I thought about the Asian women working 12 hours a day in garment sweatshops both abroad and in places like L.A. to make clothes for people like this guy’s kids; and I wondered, in what sense were they “doing so well?”

I thought about the Vietnamese youth in California who are profiled as potential gang members by police, for wearing the “wrong” colors; and I wondered, in what sense were they “doing so well?”

I thought about the Asian families whose members have to put in 80 hours a week just to keep their heads above water; and I wondered, in what sense were they “doing so well?”

I thought about the Indian, Pakistani or Bangladeshi taxi drivers who endure crappy working conditions, customers who get pissy about their accents or “attitudes,” and cops who are responsible for nearly 80% of all anti-South Asian attacks — often against hack drivers in places like New York; and I wondered, in what sense were they “doing so well?”

I thought about the demonization of Wen Ho Lee, and Chinese American political contributors during the Clinton Administration; and the beating death of Vincent Chin; and the persistent refrain that the Japanese are “buying up America;” and I wondered, in what sense were they “doing so well?”
The Myth of the ‘Model Minority’
But instead of getting into those things, which likely wouldn’t have been seen as responsive by my detractor, I offered the following.

First, I noted that the Asian “model minority” myth has long been a staple of white conservative race commentary, though rarely have members of the various Asian communities in the U.S. pushed the notion themselves.

The genesis of this argumentation goes back to the 1950s and 60s, when prominent magazines ran articles lauding the “hard-working” Chinese or Japanese, and explicitly contrasting their “success” with the “failure” of African Americans.

That they offered such a contrast at the height of the modern Civil Rights Movement — as if to say to black folks, “stop complaining about racism and just work harder” — should not be lost on anyone.

Of course, none of these magazines ever editorialized in favor of lifting immigration restrictions that had kept Asian populations small in the U.S. from the 1880s until 1965, despite their respect for the “model minorities.”

Neither did any such admirers speak out against internment of “hard-working” Japanese Americans during World War II, or the killing of hard-working Southeast Asians during the Vietnam War.

The Role of Self Selection
Secondly, I explained that comparisons between blacks and Asian Pacific Americans (APAs) overlook a number of differences between them. Whereas the black population represents a cross-section of background and experience, the APA community is highly self-selected.

Voluntary migrants from nations that aren’t contiguous to their country of destination tend to be people with the skills and money needed to leave their home country in the first place. As many scholars have found, Asian immigrants are largely drawn from an occupational and educational elite in their countries of origin.

Indeed, Asian “success” in the U.S. relative to others is largely due to immigration policies that have favored immigrants with pre-existing skills and education. As the Glass Ceiling Commission discovered in 1995, two-thirds to three-quarters of the highly-educated APA community already had college degrees before coming to the U.S. or were in college upon arrival.

Thanks to preferences for educated immigrants, APA’s are two-thirds more likely than whites and three times more likely than blacks to have a college degree. More than 8 in 10 Indian immigrants from 1966-1977 had advanced degrees and training in such areas as science, medicine or engineering.

A Case of Cultural Superiority… or Caste Status?
Pre-existing educational advantages are implicated in Asian success, but they hardly indicate genetic or cultural superiority.

After all, to claim superior Asian genes or culture as reasons for achievement in the U.S. requires we ignore the rampant poverty of persons from the same genetic or cultural backgrounds in their countries of origin.

There is no shortage of desperately poor Asians in the slums of Manila, Calcutta and Hong Kong: testament to the absurdity of cultural superiority claims for Asians as a group.

Indeed, ethnic Koreans in Japan, as well as the Burakumin there — a minority treated much like the Dalits in India — consistently under perform the dominant Japanese in terms of education and employment status.

Both are targets of discrimination, and although they are culturally and genetically indistinguishable from other Koreans or Japanese, they are consistently found at the bottom of Japanese society, and do worse than others in Japan and Korea.

Not only does this debunk the notion of pan-Asian cultural superiority, it also suggests that a group’s caste status influences group outcomes: much as with blacks in the U.S., whose position has been similar to the Burakumin and ethnic Koreans in Japan.

A Closer Look at the Statistics
The primary argument put forth on behalf of the model minority myth is that APA income in the U.S. is higher than the average for other people of color and even whites. As such, it is suggested, racial discrimination must be long gone.

But data showing Asians doing better than whites is family and household data, not per capita income data. This is important because APA households and families tend to have more family members (slightly higher incomes have to cover more persons), and more earners per family (it takes more folks working to earn only slightly more than whites).

The average Asian household size, for example, is 3.3 persons, compared to only 2.5 per household for whites. Likewise, Asian American families are more likely than white families to have two income earners, and nearly twice as likely to have three earners.

So while Asian household and family income is higher than that for whites, the median income per person is lower for Asians: as much as $2000 less annually.

Location Location Location
An additional reason why the average income of Asian families is higher than that of whites is because Asians are concentrated in parts of the country that have higher average incomes and costs of living.

The three states with the largest Asian populations and a disproportionate share of the overall Asian population (California, New York and Hawaii), rank 13th, 4th, and 16th in terms of average income — all within the top third of states.

Whereas 76% of Asian Americans live in higher-income regions of the West and Northeast, only 41% of whites and 28% of blacks live there.

More than half of all APA’s in the U.S. live in just five major U.S. cities — Honolulu, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Chicago and New York City — all of which have higher than average household incomes, and much higher costs of living than most of the U.S.

According to the Census Bureau, in 1996 median household income was about $35,500. But in states with disproportionate shares of Asians, it was $39,000 and $42,000 respectively.

This means APA median income will be skewed upward, relative to the rest of the country. But given cost of living differences, actual disposable income and living standards will be no better and often worse.

More importantly, claims of Asian success obscure the fact that the Asian American child poverty rate is nearly double the white rate. And according to a New York Times report in May of 1996, Southeast Asians as a whole have the highest rates of welfare dependence of any racial or ethnic group in the United States.

Nearly half of all Southeast Asian immigrants and refugees in the U.S. live in poverty, with annual incomes in 1990 of less than $10,000 per year.

Degrees of Difference
Amazingly, even those Southeast Asians with college degrees face obstacles. Two-thirds of Lao and Hmong-American college graduates live below the poverty level, as do nearly half of Cambodian Americans and over a third of Vietnamese Americans with degrees.

Indeed, Asian “success” rhetoric ignores the persistent barriers to advancement faced by Asians relative to whites. On average, APA’s with a college degree earn 11% less than comparable whites, and APA’s with a high school diploma earn 26% less than white counterparts.

When Asian American men have qualifications comparable to white men, they still receive fewer high-ranking positions than those same white men. APA male engineers and scientists are 20% less likely than white men to move into management positions in their respective companies, despite no differences in ambition or desire for such positions.

Why Not a Flood of Asian Genius?
Beyond statistics, there are other points to be made. First, if whites truly believe Asians are culturally superior and add to the quality of schools and workplaces, then why aren’t these folks clamoring for a massive increase in immigration from Asian nations?

Why not flood the borders, since we could all benefit from a little more Asian genius? Why not have white CEO’s step down from their positions and let Japanese managers take their place?

Secondly, whites who trumpet the model minority concept would be the first to object if Asian Americans began to bump their own white children from college slots, even if they did so by way of higher test scores and “merit” indicators.

Just ask yourself what would happen if next year the top 3500 applicants to U.C.-Berkeley, in terms of SAT score and grades, happened to be Asian Americans, especially since there are only 3500 slots in the freshman class.

Would the regents allow the freshman class at the state’s flagship school to become 100% Asian? Or for that matter even 80% or 70%?

How would white Californians react to such a development, including those who praise hard-working Asian kids for their educational excellence and scholarly achievements?

How would white alums react if their favorite “model minorities” were suddenly seen as taking slots not from black and Latino youth, but from their own white children? To ask the question is to answer it.

Moral and Ethical Responsibility
And finally, to argue that “Asians have made it, so why can’t blacks,” is to misunderstand the issue of moral and ethical responsibility to correct the harm of wrongful actions.

Even if we accept that groups victimized by racism can “make it” without affirmative action or reparations, it would not deny (or indeed speak to in any way) the fact that society has an obligation to compensate the victims of injustice.

After all, if my leg is blown off in an industrial accident, it hardly matters that many people with only one leg go on to succeed. The issue of compensatory justice remains, irrespective of what gains one can make without compensation.

I have little reason to think any of this made a difference to the individual who chose that day to trumpet Asian success as a way to denigrate blacks.

Given some of his other comments — that black promiscuity was to blame for AIDS in Africa, that he resented the “fact” that his black son (presumably adopted) has more opportunity in life than his white son (despite that, as he noted, the former is unemployed and the latter in college) — his ability to rationally decipher much of anything seems doubtful.

Nonetheless, challenging the model minority myth is a worthwhile enterprise, especially when one considers how many decent, well-meaning individuals often fall for it.

A Carrot… And a Big Stick
Those who trumpet “Asian values and culture” — based on stereotypical understandings of both, not unlike the white guys who covet mail-order Asian brides for their anticipated “docility” — do Asians no favors.

If anything, they set them up in a way that not only harms the groups against which they are contrasted, but in a way that harms Asians as well.

To be considered a group filled with math and science geniuses and passive, sensual, and willing female companions, not only objectifies Asian Pacific Americans, but results in a special stigma for those in the various Asian groups who aren’t good in school, don’t know how to fix your computer nor care to do so, or who don’t fit the sexist stereotypes that are so comforting to Western male tastes.

The model minority myth, in other words, is a setup: a carrot offered to certain groups so long as they don’t get out of line, assert their rights, strike for better wages, or try to determine their own sexuality. And as with all carrots, there is an even bigger stick, ready to throttle those who don’t go along with the game.

Ultimately, justice and equity will remain elusive as long as whites feel no compunction about using one group of color against another group of color, in an attempt to make fools of both.

Comment by Tae-Seung Kim

12 February 2005 @ 11:36 am

Racism is not good. I want to tell you people that racism is ugly and will never end unless the feeling of ignorance, hatred and superiority fades. Face it, life is ugly and racism is everywhere around the world. Unfortunately racism is made by those ignorant, uneducated slob scums of bitches and bastards. I’m not speaking this from a Korean’s person’s view point but rather my own. We can all be racist from time to time no one can deny it. To tell you the truth I was racist from time to time and it’s just not me. Koreans as well as blacks and other races can be racists towards other race/nation. There are bad and good ones scattered everywhere throught the race. So when your talking your hate through another race, that shows your mere complexion in your biased judgement so please you people need to be educated. You PEOPLE make me sick. I’m going to go to sleep so don’t blant your hate on this website because that will create more tensions with Koreans and blacks so keep your low-level explanations to yourself and just beat it out on to yourself or the helpless concrete. Having said that you people need to go to sleep ok GOODBYE ASSHOLES. SWEET DREAMS. MUAH. Bye.

Comment by spikes

16 February 2005 @ 12:58 am

I have learned that being in Korea for 9 months that there are racist Koreans and some are not most are generally nice but there is always some apprehension when they see an african american because on tv we are portrayed as thieves, killers, and generally bad people. My girlfriend is Korean and when we ride the subway how many men look at her like she is trash because she is with me or the way she dresses. I had to get use to that but Koreans are like all other societies but Korean men treat their women like crap and I hate that because most are real nice and humble but that is there culture so I can only hope that one day there will be no racism but it will never happen even if we all the same color something will always seperate people

Comment by milkandcereal

1 March 2005 @ 1:21 pm

I personally I have not seen this racism in my area and probably not as strong here in Cali. I am offended when koreans are mixed with chinese. They’re totally different nationalities.

Comment by honest_1

3 April 2005 @ 12:18 am

I would like to say that Korea is really a racist place to be.
If you apply for a job as an english teacher, they will ask you what color are you.
I mean thats a sad thing to do.
And lets be honest about something, most asians like to kiss the white mans ass, simply because they see them as rich, powerful and being wanted by society in general.
It goes like; the darker you are the worst you are.
I blame that concept on white people, because they are the ones who started that.
So now a days is quite simple; the darker is your skin the worst you get off.

Comment by Dano

4 April 2005 @ 7:04 am

It is a shame how some events and shameful acts of an individual can bring about uproar of misdirected hatred and condemning of a race. But I believe this is much greater then the dispute between the Blacks and Koreans. It’s everywhere. Whites against Blacks, Black against Asians, Asians against Indians (India), Hispanics against Whites and so on. There are more but I would not bother mentioning the rest.
Not to long ago I herd of a movement started by a small number of black clothes designers in Washington D.C. trying to play the race card in order to convince the black community from purchasing and wearing the line of clothing produced by the Korean owned apparel company. They used fliers with picture depicting an Asian male with slanted eyes and Bubble caption written in broken English slenderizing the blacks. The motivation was for black people to stick together and put the outsider out of business so that the black designers will have a chance. This movement was quickly stifled by their own people within the community who deem the movement to be out right stupid.
I applaud the people for rising above the bigotry and not sink down to the level of those who are so insecure that in order to get what they want they would even consort to the very idea that had suppressed the blacks for so long, Racism.
Through out this world, it doesn’t matter where. You will find small pockets of bigots who will raise their voice in ignorance and desperation to be herd. To tell the world of how their ignorant and small closed off minds were hurt by the bad people. People! it’s simple as this judge the people or I should say person (if it’s just an individual) by the action, not by their nationality. We have all been brain washed with preconception of how certain people of certain nationality are that we are forgetting the most important thing. People are people and the good, the bad and the ugly are everywhere!!!!!!
You want an example? Look how the world famous Walt Disney sometimes portrays people of certain nationality in some of their cartoons. Black person depicted as an African bushman running around with just a loincloth, and why does all Asian’s have slanted eyes? They are not slanted; some Asians just don’t have the fold in the eyelids that’s gives the size and the roundness, (The term squinty eyes would fit more readily) many do have the same features as your so called round eyed. And who came up with the notion that all Hispanics must be someone doing your lawn?
The worst thing about this whole situation is that these distorted portrayal are being exposed and brain washed into our young and no one has challenged it. Hmmmmm, makes you think doesn’t it? Like a brilliant man once said. All men are created equal. And let me just add to that famous line with a word of my own, prosecute the individual fool or bigot for his, her or their actions not the race. If someone in an another country slenderizes you slander that individual or group back not the whole country. After all we are race of human beings right? Peace…

Comment by krzintegraboi

9 April 2005 @ 5:58 am

hello i went to korea for awhile i had fun over there met some friends but racist people agaist blacks are everywhere i felt it and heard it over there but i also get it here in the states so it doesnt matter where we go its prob there but…ive also been to japan they really hate koreans there i have a friend there thats 1/4 korean she can loose her so called friends if they knew she had any korean in her.that is so wrong but like i said its everywhere ..for the anti-american thing in korean because ive seen it all the time there even on the subways ..all that needs to be done is every US military post needs to pull out there that way only americans they will see are tourist ..while i was there i tried to learn some of the culture some stuff i like some i didnt .. but oh well i still love my home stat of Florida

Comment by Tracy 트래이시

10 April 2005 @ 9:35 pm

Greetings,

I am an African American man living in Korea.( good way to start this off right? *^^*) First of all let me say, I LOVE KOREA!! This country is soo cool and great, with people, with great food, and a beautiful language!
Now, that I have set this up correctly, let me whole heartily agree that lots of Koreans are totally racist. Haha, I have had my share of racism, but it is not unlike some areas in the states or Britain. I mean really, in some smaller rural areas of Korea there are people who have never seen a black man let alone spoken to one. That could be a good thing or a bad thing. I have had whole seats to myself on the subway on occasion, which is great if you have ever been here because man it gets really crowded sometimes!! (LEG ROOM BABY YEAH!!) lol Yes, sometimes you get the little smart comments especially from some of the younger crowds that don’t realize “That HEY! Maybe he speaks a little Korean” hehe. But I take it all with a grain of salt. In every place on the globe, people will look at you and summarize you by your race, age, clothing etc. It’s just a natural thing.
A lot of the misconceptions about race especially the black race could be blame on we Americans ourselves. Just look at are television programming. Lets pretend aliens in space existed, they have never seen Humans before, they only have viewed us from Television programs… damn… we would seem like a bunch of pretty damn silly, perverted, sexually motivated violent people(technically true but that’s another blog LOL). That’s the same concept. In television we are drug addicts, con men, ignorant thugs, criminal etc… so these images get broadcast and stuck into the minds of people in Asia. Just look at what some Westerners think about Asians, “THEY ALL HAVE SLANTED EYES, THEY ALL DO SOME TYPE OF MARTIAL ARTS AND THEY ALL LOOK THE SAME” I had an idiot friend recently tell me that Jackie Chan was Japanese… I’ve been to Japan and I’ll tell you what.. There are not too many Chans walking around there lol.( Jackie Chan is Chinese) our job as human beings is to educate each other about our cultural differences.
I recently became great friends with a female Korean. She said I was her first black friend. She stated that she had a prejudice of blacks and that she had no reason for it. It was just a simple respect thing. One day I saw her really down, and I simply asked her what was wrong and is there do anything I could do to cheer her up. We began to talk. I told her what I liked about Korea and disliked. We shared a few drinks together and before you know it she was laughing again and having a good time. (of course don’t walk up to ANY Korean and try this) lol! Anyways, we have been buddies for 5 months now! (There are many others too)
We as a society soo quickly jump to the race card. I believe it is the individual responsibility of each person to learn about other cultures. I mean “really” learn. Education, knowledge and patience, is the key to most problems in the world. If you know a little about their culture and can speak a little of their language you can earned their respect, because it shows you are at least trying. Sometimes with these things you have to take the first step and be the bigger person and learn about them first. I for one will never stop studying about other cultures. Soon, I want to go to Indonesia so I am teaching myself the Bahasa language now.. Well just enough to get around, I have a friend there so I want to visit. I think we should never stop educating ourselves, once we stop learning we become dumb, narrow minded and stubborn in our thinking and ways.
We will never ever really stop racism or prejudice. In some shape or form it is imprinted in the minds of most people across the globe even with interracial couples. Anyways– this is my 2 cents.. and then some–Tracy

Comment by Dyna

23 April 2005 @ 9:18 am

I have been to Korea a few times myself. And never really encountered any problems even in the rural areas. However, you would think that Americans being stationed in parts of Korea Koreans would accept that Americans not only bring stability but also booster their sagging economy. But it seems the total opposite. I know that every country has their good people and bad people but it seems that the young people do not want to reach out and try and make friends. They are more into having Americans leave or protest than acceptance. We accept Koreans in the U.S. and yet Koreans do not really accept Americans. One day, when it will be time to go and you need our help like you have had in the past we might not be there to help your country out again.

Comment by ReverendBing

11 June 2005 @ 11:31 am

Well it is true, NIGGERS are filth. They commit over 60% of the crime in America, kill Whites constantly, get free rides and their “culture” is complete crap. It is always about rape, drugs or cars. Ever been to Africa? Baby Rapes, Rape, Drugs, Murder CONSTANTLY, you can’t even drive around in most places or you will get car jacked in broad daylight and if you are a woman well if they jack you they will probably rape you and end it with murder. Niggers have not advanced in 6000 years either my friend, the Asians are simply saying the truth. NIGGERS ARE FILTH. http://niggermania.com/tom/funniggerfacts/funniggerfacts.html For more fun nigger facts.

Comment by Alex

13 June 2005 @ 6:14 am

Touching comments Tracy, I am glad you like Korea despite the few bigots.

ReverendBing - thank you for bringing your profound and well-writen ideas to this blog, one question however what the F**K does this have to do with Korea?

Comment by Tina

13 June 2005 @ 12:57 pm

This is very sad. I am a Black American. My best friend is Korean. We get along fine because we talk about different issues openly. I have open my heart and my eyes to her culture and she has open her heart and eyes to mine. We respect each other. She told me that out off all the people she has met, it is black americnas who have shown her respect. Now I gotta question. Why do people hate blacks so much. Why are we the ones that have to endure so much hate? When we speak up we are whinning and complaining. Tell that to the Jews next time they mention the Holocaust. I am tired of this. Why US!?!?!?! What did we do? We didnt run fast enough when the slave catchers caught us. We didnt pick cotton fast enough? We stop saying massu and Naw Suh to quick? We started reading to quick? Somebody tell me! Why us, Why my people. Am I stupid because God made my color darker than yours, my nose wider than yours, my lips bigger than yours? The same features that lighter skin women pay thousands for. I tell you what, if you hate me so much for being what GOD made me then on Judgement day tell him. I don’t want to hear it. Keep putting on your black face, tanning your bodies, altering your features to look like me and talking about how stupid I am. Your the peron with issues

Comment by Tae-Seung Kim

25 June 2005 @ 9:29 am

hey no need for racism. To tell you the truth, I’m sure that no one wants problem with black ppl. I would rather co-exist with Black ppl with having no problems on both side. Let alone be no more theft, rape, and murder, racism, and assualt. This world needs to learn how to educate the uneducated ones and start helping the poor people but then there are stupid ones that spent those money on drugs and not on their home.

Comment by teacher_101

27 June 2005 @ 7:56 am

I was an English teacher in Korea. I encountered both positive and negative things. One time a Korean kid asked me where I was from. I said American and he said “Oh, the fucking USA”. Another time we were playing hangman and a Korean kid spelled out “colony”. There was alot of kids singing fucking USA. I ignored all of this.

A few times a Korean would give me a “You just killed my mother or dropped a atomic bomb on my hometown look”. You know the look you get before being stoned to death. But I ignored it. Other times it was less threating “What are you doing here?? Why don’t you go away annoyed look.” Usually it involves a I just lost all my money on the poker machine look. Well you get that from an older brother or a school bully anywhere.

Other times I would here “fuck you” on the subway. But they won’t say it to your face just loud enough so you can here it.

A Korean teacher gave me a lecture about imperialism and how Koreans thought 9/11 was “cool”. He said Clinton was a good president.
Does that mean that he would not laugh at the deaths of Americans under a Clinton adminstration?

A Canadian teacher remarks to a Korean how much he hates Bush, Southerners, and America (right in front of me) to impress Koreans. He starts talking and joking about the KKK because I said I was from the South (but not the deep south).

One time I said that Koreans should defend Korea
to a bunch of hostile middle schoolers. Basically I really did believe what I said. I don’t want Americans in Korea. It’s not my problem plus everybody thinks were pigs. I don’t want US troops all over the world. What’s the point? Just leave all these people alone. It’s not cowardly. It’s just minding your own business.
Are we the new England and Spain of the new century?

My remarks were not that of a puppet but those of historical fact. If I were a puppet then
I would be praising the “great Korea” that shits on handicapped people and southeast Asians. I know that’s bullcrap.

They began to act nice to me. However, one student still remarked later in class that 9/11 was good and the Saudi hijackers were “heroes”. That was not the message I was getting across. The student still viewed American people as the enemy and not human. They were stereotypes except for me of course.

So what is the source of all this anger? Is it jealousy? Is it American Imperalism?

Let’s examine the history:

1. The United States recognized Japanese control
over Korea in exchange for Japanese recognition
of American colonial rule in the Phillippines.
Very few Koreans probably know this or care but it’s a fact.

2. The US divided Korea with the Russians like Germany. However, Korea did not commit any crimes.
It was liberals (Truman, FDR) that did this.

3. We saved thier butt from Communist rule. They
are now the 12th largest economy in the world.
However, the North Koreans were able to turn the conflict into a race war. This use of nationalism has been effective to this day.

4. Probably a few American jackasses have looked down on and malgraded Korean nationals. But that happens with any army.

5. We ran over some schoolgirls and might have
been involved in the Gwangju massacre. Unfortunate tragedies that ignite hatred against the US.

6. Bush delares North Korea the axis of Evil and begins a big anti-terror war.

Malcolm X described two types of African American.
There was a field and house negro. You meet alot of field and house negroes in Asia. However, the ideal person is someone in between. I don’t want someone kissing or kicking my ass. We cannot live in the John Lennon “Imagine” world as long as we have field and house negroes. You can just postpone the “Kum Buh Yah” song.

Why do Asians feel inferior to Westerners? I guess they think all Americans come from New York and California. When I came from Appalachia to Seoul I was looking up at the Koreans not down. I’d never rode a subway before or been in a huge city. I was wondering why do these people have an inferiority complex when they are not inferior.
Korean money is equal to American money. I don’t have no advantage here like in the Phillippines. SO WHAT’S THE PROBLEM?

In the Phillippines, they need a Asian power movement. You can have sex with anyone and even children are put on display. “Hey you want to screw my sister for 10 dollars? ” They believe they are inferior to white people. They are house negroes. This is a generalization of course.

Are Americans racist against Asians in the US?
I don’t know. Sometimes I see stuff written like “KKK” “chinks” and “dog meat rules” (funny because Chinese don’t eat dog meat) in the bathroom of the local Chinese restuarant. I don’t like that because I know what it’s like to be a minority IN ASIA.

I think many Koreans are being crybabies. Get over it! Maybe I need to get over it. No, they started it. I did not come to Korea to discuss politics.

Okay now here is the positive part. Some people say Koreans are racist. However, many of my adult students agreed yellow, black, and white people will mix one day. That was’nt what I expected to here. I have met a quite a few Korean that like hip-hop. In fact my boss owned a hip hop bar. I told him that blacks need a nation composed of one ethnic group like Korea. He said “Were all the same.”. Koreans are racist, xenophobic and homophobic? Well so are people in Appalachia. You got the same situation as Korea. Hillbilly kids who like hip hop!

Some people say Koreans are clean freaks. I said that Koreans were clean in my class one day. A student (who was a medical doctor) remarked “Well I’m not clean!”

There was some harrassment in Seoul but not in the other town I was at. Maybe I was just there at a tense time.

Overall I have had a great time in Korea. There was some trying times. However, it says in the Bible “It’s easy to get praise from friends and not enemies.” So what if you live in a place where everyone likes you. That’s not impressive. But if you can live in a place where
people are hostile and survive then that’s an accomplishment. Anyways, here are some stuff I like about Korea.

1. Kimchi

2. beef soup

3. 2000 a month and a free apartment

4. the tough korean work ethic and attitude

5. the mountains and ocean

6. the subways and other public transportation

7. Korean people (the ones that are not black muslims)

8. Korean women

9. The Korean Jin Jae Bah

10. The attention and James Bond feeling I get.

11. The overall exciting feeling.

You got to be kidding me I LOVE KOREA !!!

Do you agree with my thoughts and ideas or have these Koreans driven me nuts? What are your thoughts?

Comment by teacher_101

28 June 2005 @ 9:30 am

I want to clear come things up. I don’t like the North Koreans. The North Koreans do medical experiments and other tortures on men, women, and children. They hold thousands or maybe millions in prison camps. They allow no freedom and have a “1984″ society.

They are evil despite what thier press releases say. The US forces are in Korea because the majority of Koreans do not like Communism. They can’t defend thier own country so they use the Americans. These young South Koreans don’t really like Communism either. If that were so then many would defect to North Korea. That has not happened. These young Koreans should either tell thier government leaders they want a strong Korea capable of it’s own defence or be quiet.

The new anti-US propoganda says the Americans are the “New Japanese”. Now young middle school students hear about No-Go Ri massacre thru the “fucking USA” song. So now they believe Americans are savage murderers like the Japanese.
This presents a tough problem for American English teachers who want respect from thier students. How can they get respect from thier students when they are viewed as “devils”. I know this sounds melodramatic but I came across this attitude quite frequently. Are the US forces extentions of the Japanese like supposedly we were extentions of the French in Vietnam?

Let’s look at the facts. Are we Japanese in disguise?

1. Young South Koreans hate Communism despite thier anti-american views. They live well under capitalism and won’t trade it in for Communism.

2. South Koreans have plenty to eat under the supposed “American Colonial Rule” The Japanese
would sometimes hold back rice from the Koreans.
They were hated for this and it was understandable.

3. The Americans are not forcing Koreans to give up thier native language and learn English. Perhaps they did this with Native Americans but not in Korea. The Japanese tried to destroy the Korean language and culture and replace it with Japanese language and culture. Some South Koreans
are learning English now. However, they are not being forced (well maybe by the job market but that’s another topic). Anyways, English is western not American.

4. America commited some crimes in the Korean War as they did in the Vietnam war. Does this make the North Vietnamese or North Koreans the “good guys”? Heck no! Both of those countries along with the Cambodians and Laotians led thier people into the dark age. Have you ever seen “The Killing Fields”? Communism and the “middle ages” suck. Nobody wants to live like that. Everyone wants the modern western way.

5. The US made mistakes in the Korean War and Vietnam but that does not justify the North Korean and Vietnamese regimes. Truman sent in US forces with full knowledge that a risk of Chinese attack existed. A full US victory was not possible with Chinese intervention. The only alternative was nuclear war which the US was unwilling to go thru with. What was the best solution? First, they should’nt have divided Korea to begin with. Truman and FDR trusted the Russians too much. They should have made a plan for an Korea free of outside influence (Chinese, Russian, Japanese or American). The same thing is true with Vietnam. ” A house divided cannot stand” - Abaraham Lincoln

6. The USA is not stealing the natural and human resources of South Korea. If that were true then
Korea would not be the 12th largest economy in the world. The Japanese used everything to benefit Japanese industry.

7. Unlike some of my Native American Cherokee ancestors, there are millions of Koreans. The Koreans may have had a tough time but they survived and are thriving. So get over it!

8. Mao, Pol Pot and Stalin killed millions of people despite what you hear in anti-american propoganda. The communists are no heroes.
How can these anti-American protesters be so self righteous? Communists were big murderers. I won’t say if Americans are murderers or not. I will let you